He’s a rock god, adored by many and worth millions. Yet The Who’s Pete Townshend has regrets. ‘I always feel I wish I’d left before the band got famous and been an artist,’ says the former art school student. ‘I think I would have been happier.’
This jaw-dropping moment of reflection comes after we’ve been watching the dancers of Sadler’s Wells rehearse a new ballet that is based on his wife Rachel Fuller’s orchestration of the rock opera Quadrophenia, written by Pete and released as an album by The Who in 1973. It’s the story of Jimmy, a young man having a breakdown during the legendary clashes between Mods and Rockers on Brighton seafront in 1964. And Pete was actually there.
‘I was seeing a girl from art school,’ he says. ‘We missed the last train and it was raining so we went under the pier with a bunch of Mods. The so-called fighting was over. We were all on amphetamines, babbling away. It was very happy and incredibly romantic. Funnily enough, I’ve never talked to her about it since.’
Seeing the dancers devise a gorgeous, stylised version of those days has made him nostalgic. ‘It is amazing and enchanting. You think you’re writing music, but in fact you may be engaged in therapy,’ says the guitarist and songwriter, who turns 80 next week. ‘I felt incredible emotion watching them do this, as an old man looking back on my young years. I was moved to think about how I would never be young like that again. I would never move like that again. I would never be so curious again.’
Quadrophenia was made into a film starring Phil Daniels as Jimmy. Even then it was nostalgic for Pete. ‘I was a funny-looking little lad with a big nose. There were moments when I looked quite beautiful. There were moments when I didn’t. But I loved the Mod scene, the dancing, the clothes. I wasn’t confident, so I was trying to fit into something.’
The Who, with their target and arrow motifs that still identify the culture, came to define the Mods. But the writer of My Generation thought they would blaze bright and burn out fast. ‘I expected The Who to self-destruct in six months. That’s why I threw myself into performing in a bloody manner. I hurt myself on the stage. I smashed guitars I could only just afford. But my personal manifesto was absolute: “This is a brief moment in music history. It won’t turn into…” Well, what it turned into.’
Success is what he means. The Who were one of the biggest bands of the so-called British Invasion of America, along with The Beatles and The Rolling Stones. What was his problem? ‘I was deeply into a college course about how art was going to have a revolutionary function. So I felt The Who were a bit silly, maybe a bit beneath me, I’m afraid.’ And how does he see it now? ‘I feel the same. I think they feel beneath me.’
That must cause trouble with Roger Daltrey. ‘Roger and I have conversations about this. Sometimes he thinks I should be more grateful.’ The Who’s lead singer may have a point. If Pete had quit there would have been no hits like Substitute or Pinball Wizard. No appearances at Woodstock or Live Aid. No fame and no fortune. So, is he serious? ‘I should have left, I think. That’s OK. I don’t regret feeling that. It’s just that there was a life I could have had that I missed.’
His old course leader Roy Ascott is now 90 and still a digital artist. ‘He’s the same as he was: far-thinking, far-sighted. He doesn’t have that much money, I helped him a little bit personally, but I find myself thinking, “Yeah, this is a life I wouldn’t have minded having.”‘
Roger Daltrey (pictured) and Pete performing on their American tour in 2022
Pete with his wife Rachel Fuller
Pete doubts his first wife Karen would have agreed to go out with him, though. ‘We’d just been in Paris performing to the stars of French cinema when I wrote her a letter: “Do you fancy a date?” If I hadn’t been famous, she might not have come.’
They married in 1968 and had three children. Emma and Aminta are in their fifties, a gardening writer and a film producer respectively. Joseph, 35, runs a sound design studio. They had a lot to live up to. ‘I did so much of my best work when I was a kid. All of the big, important stuff before I was 35. We didn’t have a lot of money, our managers were crooks, but I was the songwriter and had my publishing company so we lived well. I still felt something was wrong.’
He sought solace in the rock’n’roll lifestyle – although not as energetically as one band member. ‘I don’t know that my behaviour was particularly Quaker, but our drummer Keith Moon was a handful,’ he says. ‘Oh God, he was desperate for attention. I remember him and Vivian Stanshall [of the Bonzo Dog Doo-Dah Band] dressed up as Hitler and Goebbels and went to one of my favourite Jewish restaurants in Whitechapel. The customers were outraged. Keith got three tabloid front pages out of it. I said, “Yeah, I get what you’re doing, but this is not what we’re about.”‘
The guitarist of the loudest band in rock preferred the ballet. ‘Our manager Kit Lambert had a box. I used to go there for a nap.’ But when was he won over by the art? ‘Some time in the mid-60s. I was passing by the Royal Opera House on my own. I went up to Kit’s box and had my nap, then woke up in the middle of this amazing ballet based on the music of Benjamin Britten. There was a boy in a boat. The ballet and the presentation were beautiful. I was moved. That was my initiation.’
After that he got to know dancers. ‘I met the great American dancer Gelsey Kirkland after Romeo And Juliet. She was covered in vomit because of stage fright. She’d glide on stage, vomiting. It’s a f****** tough life, ballet.’
Pete and Karen separated in 1994. Two years later he met the composer Rachel Fuller, who was then in her twenties. She started to orchestrate his work, including a version of Quadrophenia with the Royal Philharmonic Orchestra and Alfie Boe. ‘I remember saying, “This would make a fabulous ballet.” She’d never been to the ballet, so I started to take her.’ They married in secret in 2016.
The new production captures the spirit of our times, with many young men in crisis. Pete says they can learn from what happens to Jimmy after he’s dumped by the girl he loves and let down by his hero. ‘I wanted to give Jimmy that moment of surrender that leads to a spiritual revelation,’ he says. ‘What’s going on at the moment with toxic masculinity is that the younger generations don’t understand that spirituality leads to action, self-deprecation, inviting a new life. Certain Buddhist principles, as opposed to “I live through my phone” and “I hate the way this girl has set me up”.’
He’s quoting the plot of the acclaimed Netflix drama Adolescence. ‘I was so triggered by the first episode I couldn’t watch the rest. It reminded me of my childhood,’ he admits. ‘My mother sent me to live with my grandmother, who was insane. I suffered abuse, deprivation and bullying for two years, until a neighbour realised I was in trouble and called my dad. He got Mum to bring me home and life settled down. I said to Rachel, “Adolescence was brilliant, but I had a bad night after watching it.”‘
The couple now live in Oxfordshire, but were still in London in 2003 when Pete was questioned on suspicion of downloading child porn. He told police he’d been researching a project about how big banks are complicit with paedophilia. He had made a payment to prove his point but had cancelled straight away without seeing anything. The search took months, but no images were found.
Six years ago, during a previous interview, Pete stunned me by suggesting the arrest had saved him from a terrible fate. ‘I had a cancerous polyp in my bowel. While I was waiting for the police to go through my computers, I decided to have that long-postponed colonoscopy. The doctor showed me the polyp. He said, “This would have killed you in six months.” So it sort of saved my life.’
He is surprised to be reminded of it now. ‘That’s right, I was diagnosed. I often forget that,’ he says.
The ballet will be part of his legacy, but what about The Who? There was speculation after Pete and Roger, the only two surviving members of the classic lineup, played two gigs for the Teenage Cancer Trust in March, and Roger stepped down from curating those gigs, which he’d been doing since 2000. ‘It’s too hard, he has to spend the whole year trying to persuade people who don’t want to do it,’ Pete says. It emerged that drummer Zak Starkey, son of Beatles legend Ringo Starr, had been sacked by Roger. ‘I tried to mediate and it went wrong,’ says Pete. ‘We got through those gigs by the skin of our teeth. I thought Zak was OK. He’s been through some troubles. Not drugs or anything, just family stuff. He’ll talk about that when he’s ready.’
Was his dad on the phone, one rock legend to another? ‘I saw Ringo at Eric Clapton’s 80th birthday party [the next night] and he said, “Oh, bloody hell!” But I think we’re back on course. He’s still going to play.’
So where does that leave the band? ‘It’s at the point where I’m gonna break a wrist on the stage or fall over. Roger is singing so well at the moment, but he’s an eccentric fellow. He’s not a great communicator. His hearing is very bad, so he doesn’t want to make another album, which is a pity because I really enjoyed doing the last one.’ Their relationship is famously fractious. ‘The Who will go on for as long as Roger and I can have non-conversations!’
Pete is limping from recent knee-replacement surgery. There is also the problem of memory. ‘I’m terrible at remembering lyrics. I really admire the fact that Bob Dylan can still remember 450 songs.’ Is Bob as hard to get on with as his legend suggests? ‘Yeah,’ says Pete with a grin. ‘But he’s getting better. He’s getting nicer. He always says to me, “Where’s Roger?” He likes Roger.’
So will they continue performing until their bodies or brains force them to stop? ‘I’ll keep going as long as I feel it. We’ll be on the stage and I’ll be thinking, “What the **** am I doing here?” Then the first few tricky bars of Baba O’Riley will begin and I’ll think, “I’m a f****** genius. I should be here, because this is my music.” People say I get well paid for doing a job I like. I do get well paid but I don’t like it. I don’t like being on the road. I don’t like being on stage. It does nothing for me. It makes me insincere.’
The money must help, I say. And Pete Townshend, the art school rebel who accidentally created one of the world’s most successful rock bands, says, ‘Yeah. The money is great.’
Quadrophenia, A Mod Ballet tours from 28 May-19 July. Tickets and details at modballet.com.
Quadrophenia, the film based on The Who’s rock opera, and documentary The Who: The Kids Are Alright are both available on Sky/Now
